Home > Uncategorized > Christian responses to encountering the Beast 666

Christian responses to encountering the Beast 666

Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law.

If anything, this blog ‘Christianity is Dead’ has exposed many Christians to the Law of Liberty. These are quotations are to show that, although perhaps not accepting & promoting it, Christians are at least examining the message of Thelema:

  • “You know what – I am going to take up this challenge and look deeply at ‘Thelema’ and Aleister Crowley’s life – to see what is taught and at the heart of this philosophical pursuit…which one might call religion?” (societyvs)
  • “I read through much of your literature on the philoshopy and ideas of Thelema. Thank you first for visiting the blog and responding to the post… The idea that Christianity is dead and will be redeemed and brought to fruition & perfection through Thelema is interesting to us.” (Derek)
  • “As a Christian, I obviously disagree with much of what you believe. Still, some of what you say about Christianity is true, at least with respect to how professing followers of Christ have observably behaved.” (dave)
  • “I am interested in the law as it pertains to the U.S. Constitution and our national justice system. Clearly, I am a Christian. Additionally, my political view standpoint is a Libertarian. According to Thelema, ‘Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the Law!’ and ‘Heaven is on Earth, and we live joyously without fear of grace or guilt, having discarded the priestly bogey of sin.’ What the above statements about Thelema mean is simply: 1. Individual freedom of choice, 2. Love yourself, 3. Abide by the law. As a Libertarian, I believe in individual’s freedom of choice and this is supported by our U.S. Constitution too. Libertarians believe in limited Government to control personal liberties which does support Thelema’s statement, ‘do what you will and that is the law’ [sic!]” (Christina)
  • “I’d ask simply – what’s the point of this thelema ideology? What’s the goal – the intended ending exactly? I read and I see: we need to lose our ‘restrictions,’ Doubt has more meaning than faith, sexual repression (of any sort) is not acceptable, we all determine our own wills (which is also about sexuality in the quote), The ‘God-idea’ must be placed with the rest of the relics of times past. I have studied some Huxley (in passing fancy) and this sounds a lot like his humanistic ideals of spirituality.” (societyvs)
  • “I see that you are disciple of Aleister Crowley. I must admit even by standards of some of my occultist friends Crowley was a wicked man. A genius? Yes! A Prophet? Of Lucifer indeed! An amazingly talented writer and poet? Of course! But Wicked above all things I must concur…” (dubi0usmonk)

Love is the law, love under will.

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  1. January 7, 2010 at 10:16 am

    Please consider writing in Aleister Crowley for President in 2012. More info:http://ac2012.com/

    • January 7, 2010 at 6:29 pm

      93 ac2012 – I certainly will consider it… Thanks for the comment.

  2. Derek
    January 7, 2010 at 2:36 pm

    Mr. Thelema,
    Could you please not use my response as a quote considering it has been taken out of its context. I do not wish to sound as if I am promoting or heralding Thelema. This would be greatly appreciative. Thank you.

    • Derek
      January 7, 2010 at 2:43 pm

      Mr. Thelema,

      You can delete both of these…I’ve been thinking and praying about it some and for now please leave it up. I’m going to talk it over with the other members on the blog to make sure they do not find fault with my decision, but I believe there isn’t an issue with it. Sorry for any inconvenience.

      • January 7, 2010 at 6:28 pm

        93 Derek – Thanks for your comments. At the top of the post we are explicit that we are talking about being exposed to Thelema, not about approving of it or promoting it. It was only to show that Christians were taking the time to examine the material and post responses. Love is the law, love under will.

  3. societyvs
    January 8, 2010 at 7:15 pm

    I said I will look into Crowley…haven’t found the time yet – but I am working on it!

  4. Derek
    January 8, 2010 at 10:46 pm

    Hi Mr. Thelema,

    Thank you again for your response. I’ll be sure to mirror this post on your website as well if that will help you.

    What is the end result of Thelema, and what comes after an individual dies? I was trying to find reading on that but couldn’t quite find specific material on it. I did see something on a Holy Guardian Angel but that was all. The reason for asking is let’s say hypothetically that all individuals actually find their “True Will” and are working towards that. According to what you stated it doesn’t necessarily mean there won’t be conflict between them, but just that they will be working toward their ultimate purpose for their existence basically. So I’m trying to see the benefit that comes from individuals that find their “True Will” and don’t if they all still deal with the same obstacles, and what God’s word calls sin.

    I know that we definitely come from different points of view, but I would just ask you to consider and think through the fact that you are place mankind at the center of the universe. We can not even explain the existence of the universe and it’s where about, yet within Thelema you are placing man as the focal point of all. If we are what it is all about then we should be the defining and deciding sovereigns over all creation, but we are not, and literally have no control over many obstacles that come within our path. I don’t believe that the Word of God as it has been revealed in the Bible is unbelievable or tales that men have collected, but can be reliably proven, tested, and trusted upon (2 Peter 1:16-21). I don’t know if you read any of God’s Word but I encourage you to read some of the passages that I have spoken about throughout our discussion.
    They speak to the foundation of man’s existence: We are here to glorify the One true God of the Bible and His Son Jesus Christ. We are unable to because of sin which has severed our relationship with God, and brought the eternal punishment and condemnation upon us. But God in is love for His people has sent Jesus Christ to bear that punishment though, for all who would, repent of their sins (acknowledge they have sinned against God and will continue to do so), and then believe and have faith that Jesus Christ is the One and Only Lord and Savior of their life. I implore you with urgency to not take this lightly and seek out what God’s Word says….we will pray for your heart, and that you come to love Jesus Christ.

    • April 14, 2010 at 5:07 pm

      93 Derek,

      Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law.

      I felt compelled to respond to some of your statements.

      I would just ask you to consider and think through the fact that you are place mankind at the center of the universe.”

      Please consider the following quote from Manly Palmer Hall:

      “The twentieth century makes a fetish of civilization and is overwhelmed by its own fabrications; its gods are of its own fashioning. Humanity has forgotten how infinitesimal, how impermanent and how ignorant it actually is. Ptolemy has been ridiculed for conceiving the earth to be the center of the universe, yet modern civilization is seemingly founded upon the hypothesis that the planet earth is the most permanent and important of all the heavenly spheres, and that the gods from their starry thrones are fascinated by the monumental and epochal events taking place upon this spherical ant-hill in Chaos.”

      To place man at the center of the universe, as you suggest of Thelemites, is at least no worse than assuming God’s primacy somehow translates into an overbearing concern over submission to Him/him. But this is rather an oversimplification.

      Walter Russell writes in “The Secret of Light” that God is Light; that the infinite mind of God is the One True Light; that the mind of God manifests the finite, physical, electrical universe through the sexual interaction of polar opposites, called the Two Lights of God’s Thinking, which simulate the unity of God through the one law of rhythmic balanced interchange between the two poles. Russell’s exegesis is arguably Christian, yet this universal model harmonizes Hermeticism, Buddhism, and Vedanta, to name a few. And all with an eye towards traditional physics.

      That there is only one law to the electrical universe, and that law is BALANCE, and balance is the void between opposites, then seeking to transcend duality through the annihilation of opposites places us into a state of harmony with what you might call “the will of God”, and what I might call “the mechanical law of the universe” while freeing us from limiting definition. This is the essence of any middle path spiritual system.

      We can not even explain the existence of the universe and it’s where about

      To the contrary. When you posit the existence of infinite spacetime, you transcend causality and recognize eventuation: being without beginning or end. The very concept of infinity defies localization, because position is a relative, finite concept. The universe dwells within the mind of the All; it is holographic. This is supported scientifically by preliminary research from Fermilab that discovered a point at which the space-time continuum breaks down into “grains”. As the notion of a continuum on difference, the greatest degree of difference being polarity – a fundamental component of the law of balance – this is indicative of the unity that signifies objective, or ultimate, reality. Ultimate reality undergoes a gradual stepping-down process to manifest in the third dimension. The logic system of the subjective mind is the mechanism whereby this process occurs, given that the function of the brain is to create order and find patterns. Here we find a scientific alignment with Vedic philosophy and Qabalah.

      I am the God of my subjective universe, and this view harmonizes me with neighboring stars.

      yet within Thelema you are placing man as the focal point of all.

      Thelema recognizes the Hermetic notion of a fundamental link between the microcosm (self) and the macrocosm (universe). Thus, the personal, subjective universe is symbolic of an objective cosmic force, or consciousness. How we explore this link between self and higher self, self and Holy Guardian Angel, or self and Godhead, is personal – as Jesus advocated (apparently).

      By seeing oneself as the center of a unique universe that interacts with other unique universes, one takes personal responsibility for finding harmony insofar as one wishes to navigate or transcend the underlying system. Thus Thelema espouses a fairly existential philosophy, one of self-empowerment.

      I implore you with urgency to not take this lightly and seek out what God’s Word says….we will pray for your heart, and that you come to love Jesus Christ.

      I likewise implore you to accept that Christianity is a polyglot religion that celebrates Pagan holidays, the steeples of whose churches are as phallic (and therefore solar) as a mason’s gravestone, whose holy book is an exoteric distillation of the sacred writings and legends of other ages, whose testaments refer to two arguably different gods, whose idea of salvation first appeared in Mithrain mystery cults, whose central figure surely taught a form of Qabalah to his disciples. I further entreat you to research the creation myths of other cultures and draw honest comparisons with your own.

      It’s not an issue of “hating Jesus”. If Jesus was an actual historical figure, he was pretty cool. I respect rebellion. I suggest that Christianity has little to do with a historical Jesus; he seems to have been made into a legend that mirrors earlier, identical creation myths. I think the mythological Jesus has become so popular simply because Christianity was taken up by the Roman Empire.

      Frankly I think one of the major failings of Christianity is that it seems to mistake the primacy of God for the primacy of the Christian religion. Well, you’re only 33%, and most other institutional and/or Abrahamic religions say THEY’RE the only way to God, too. It’s a very convenient pull marketing tactic.

      “Sin” may have severed your connection with God, but I feel God within me always as I recognize the mundane as a veil for the sacred. It’s silly to assume universal separation from God just because you’ve only accessed God through Christianity. Followers of middle path disciplines, tantric yogis (technically Left Hand Path), Hindu priests, and Buddhist monks were accessing the divine long before Christianity emerged.

      “A red rose absorbs all colours but red; red is therefore the one colour that it is not.
      This Law, Reason, Time, Space, all Limitation blinds us to the Truth.
      All that we know of Man, Nature, God, is just that which they are not; it is that which they throw off as repugnant.” ~Aleister Crowley, The HIMOG

      Understand that I’m not saying Christianity is wrong. It’s just one of many metaphoric interpretations of man’s relation to the infinite that doesn’t work for everyone, and (in my opinion) perverts the infinite into a parental force that makes sacrificial demands of, and oppresses, mankind. This seems to me a deified projection of social conscience, and akin to paranoid schizophrenia.

      We all have a right to decide what “God” is for ourselves. I’ve come to see “God” as an aspect of Self, and also Self as an aspect of “God”; and I imagine you and I have different conceptions of those words.

      I see no purpose in viewing the divine as an insecure, jealous deity. A god so insecure could not be transcendent of human failings, and thus pales comparison to the All and the None alike.

      By spitting on the “crapulous creeds” of old, the Thelemite asserts himself over restriction and attains to true freedom and perfect happiness. And when he dies, he chooses to reincarnate, to dissolve, or to incorporate with the all – whatever is in accord with his will.

      I never took Christianity lightly before. It’s a bit disingenuous to pretend that anyone takes Christianity lightly when it has sought to control access to “God” all over the world for an æon. However, most Christians I’ve met take other religions pretty lightly while simultaneously demonizing them. I find that to be an expression of spiritual impoverishment. Too many Christians think everyone has to agree with them.

      Please, spare us your pity. It is a psychic attack that blasphemes the free will your god supposedly granted us all.

      Love is the law, love under will.

      {z.a.}
      (matter is all that doesn’t)

  5. January 9, 2010 at 4:41 am

    i’ve studied Crowley and find him lacking just as I do this ethic of living or religion or philosophy or whatever you would like to call it. i can’t say i can affirm too much of what you’re saying as it is simple to the point of idealistic absurdity. it’s largely based on turn of the century notions of modernism devoid of any true concept of interdependence. it is good that it calls into question restrictions that are harmful but it doesn’t consider that restriction can be good (like speed limits, legal codes, social custom)

    plus, i’d argue we can’t know the full extent of our actions no matter what.

    i like the idea of trying to draw as close to God as possible… to “Put on the Mind of Christ” as Paul put it… but we can never be completely integrated into God-like understanding. we can have aspects of it.. like peace, inclusiveness, compassion and grace, etc… but not foreknowledge, technical comprehension, or total “knowing.”

    The world is a fun place. It’s also a grim place. Partly because we made it that way and partly because God made it that way. The reason there are earthquakes is not because of sin. It’s because God put a ball of hot slop in the middle of frigid space. It cools down, and when it cools enough, the crust begins to crack. If you happen to live on one of the cracks, you’ve got problems.

    There’s a lot of tough stuff in the world and it’s simply there by God’s design. As for example, death is there by God’s design. It’s not just a punishment for sin. It’s the way the creation works. The world is an ecology of life and death, of good and evil, and God made it that way. What we decided at the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, though, was that we wanted to run the ecology a different way. We wanted to run it so we could make the good better and get rid of the evil altogether. We thought, like you do, that we could BE GOD totally. But look what we’ve done with that as a result. We’ve made death a problem to be solved. Death is not a problem to be solved. It’s a mystery to be entered and embraced. For everyone. Not just for Christians. For ducks and geese and mice and men.

  6. Derek
    January 9, 2010 at 3:05 pm

    I just had one other piece of God’s word that I wanted to share with you.

    Acts 17:22-34

    So Paul, standing in the midst of the Areopagus, said: “Men of Athens, I perceive that in every way you are very religious. For as I passed along and observed the objects of your worship, I found also an altar with this inscription, “To the unknown god.” What therefore you worship as unknown, this I proclaim to you. The God who made the world and everything in it, being Lord of heaven and earth, does not live in temples made by man, nor is He served by human hands, as though He needed anything, since He Himself gives to all mankind life and breath and everything. And He made from one man every nation of mankind to live on all the face of the earth, having determined allotted periods and the boundaries of their dwelling place, that they should seek God, in the hope that they might feel their way toward Him and find Him. Yet He is actually not far from each one of us, for “In Him we live and move and have our being,” as even some your own poets have said, “For we are indeed His offspring.” Being then God’s offspring, we ought not to think that the divine being is like gold or silver or stone, and image formed by the art and imagination of man. The times of ignorance God overlooked, but now He commands all people everywhere to repent, because He has fixed a day on which He will judge the world in righteousness by a man whom He has appointed; and of this He has given assurance to all by raising Him from the dead.” Now when they heard of the resurrection of the dead, some mocked. But others said, “We will hear you again about this.” So Paul went out from their midst. But some men joined him and believed, among whom also were Dionysius the Areopagite and a woman named Damaris and others with them.

    I know that you are in a different scenario than the people of Areopagus, but it still applies…you may not have carved idols in the same fashion they do, but you do not worship the true God that has called you to repentance and is coming to judge the world in righteousness in His appointed Son. I pray you respond in a like manner of Dionysius and Areopagite.

    I

    • January 11, 2010 at 7:05 pm

      93 Derek – Thanks for your comment and your continued concern over the salvation of my soul 😛 It is certainly an interesting passage. Do Christians worship idols when they revere Jesus on the cross? The dove as the Holy Spirit? No? Then why would anyone else’s names & images necessarily not refer to the One True God. “GOD the Father and Mother is concealed in Generation. GOD is concealed in the whirling energy of Nature…” (Book of Lies); “To you who yet wander in the Court of the Profane we cannot yet reveal all; but you will easily understand that the religions of the world are but symbols and veils of the Absolute Truth. So also are the philosophies. To the adept, seeing all these things from above, there seems nothing to choose between Buddha and Mohammed, between Atheism and Theism.” (Liber Causae). Love is the law, love under will.

      • Derek
        January 12, 2010 at 1:24 am

        Hi Mr. Thelema,
        Christian are commanded not to worship idols, and God calls us to worship Him alone. Mt. 22:37, “And He (Jesus) said to him, you sall love the LORD your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.” God desires that nothing is above or before Him in worship.
        When it comes to Jesus Christ and the Holy Spirit, they are God. God is a Trinity (Father, Son, and Holy Spirit). Three persons but one being in essence and deity…God is Triune. Mathematical it doesn’t make sense and logically I can’t explain it, but this is how God has defined, ascribed, and revealed Himself in His Word.

        For instance: 2 Corinthians 3:17, “Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.” Also, Acts 5:3-4 Peter tells Anaias that he has lied to the Holy Spirit and then to God Himself. In John 10:30, Jesus proclaims He and the Father are One. Also in Zechariah 12:10 this is a prophecy of what God’s people will do to Him. This is how it reads: God (The Father) is speaking, “And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jersusalem a Spirit of grace and pleas for mercy, so that, when they look on Me, on Him whom they have pierced, they shall mourn for Him, as one mourns for an only child, and weep bitterly over Him, as one weeps over a firstborn.” Notice the pronouns used here. God says that Israel will look on Me, God, and look on Him (God) at the same time who is the same person that they have pierced…who is it that happened too, Jesus Christ, God in the flesh.
        We continue to pray for you.

  7. January 11, 2010 at 6:55 pm

    I was born a Christian. That is to say I was immersed into the culture without choosing it for myself. I did, however, flower and fruit in the spirit of Christ. I am not a Christian any more, because of the bigotry of the church, because of Christianity’s brutishness. Lao Tzu said “the Moral man tries to reason but then turns to violence.” Aleister Crowley was wicked by the subjective terms of a tyrannically repressed patriarchal, ethnocentric, ignorant world. Let me ask you this; what do you risk as you search for truth? If there is no risk then there shall be no reward. I gladly risk your hell. I gladly live a life that is materially non-profitable for the sake of spiritual maturity and the inner satisfaction it brings. My brothers are those martyrs of past ages who were betrayed by their culture because of their inability to cohabitate with antiquated ideas of Holy tree-houses in the night time sky. When you stand before your creator you will come meekly as a guest or a beggar. When I reach the other side of the veil I will be welcomed as a conquering hero because I would not lie down and be silent. Christianity and Thelema are close friends, it is the misconceptions of the old covenant that make them incompatible. The old priesthood has been reborn through the works of Aleister Crowley. Jesus was a powerful, awakened master to whom claims were attributed and whose story was carefully deleted by the council of Nicea. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Council_of_Nicaea

    • January 11, 2010 at 6:56 pm

      93 K7RQUE RIVEN – Thanks for your comment! Interesting ideas… Love is the law, love under will.

  8. January 11, 2010 at 8:40 pm

    Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law. Ok, I don’t KNOW for certain that information was deleted about the life of Jesus Christ but there is a chronological gap AND documented instances of Canonical editing AND motive to carry out such an act. Jesus never said he was the only son of God. I feel like I have known the Thelemic law my whole life. I read the apocrypha as soon as I learned of its existence. Reading about Crowley as a young child made me fearful and angry that he would defy God. Now I see that to be Holy (set apart) you must step directly into the path of fear and discomfort to find your Will’s highest calling. I would love some council on the subject of initiation/education. How do Thelemites refer to themselves? To one another? Is my only responsibility to you to stay out of your Will’s path? I want to join this assembly and be initiated into Thelema: http://sekhetmaat.com/wiki/Home Namaste. Love is the law, love under will.

  9. Enlivened
    February 20, 2010 at 9:37 pm

    I think if you look at Crowleys end (which he chose for him self) one misses the entirety of the work and accomplishment he left behind. There are numerous others who have taken his work up and not ended up like Crowley did. That in essence is what this is about not FeEaR of what might happen otherwise no one would ever cross the road between truth and light or darkness and missunderstanding. Unfortunatley christianity is not dead and Im not sure it should die perhaps it should become truly enlightened as a path that suits some rather than die completly.

    • February 21, 2010 at 8:11 pm

      93 Enlivened – Others like who?

  10. artemis93
    September 24, 2011 at 9:40 pm

    Derek :
    Hi Mr. Thelema,
    Christian are commanded not to worship idols, and God calls us to worship Him alone. Mt. 22:37, “And He (Jesus) said to him, you sall love the LORD your God with all your heart, and with all your soul, and with all your mind.” God desires that nothing is above or before Him in worship.

    93

    But you DO worship idols. Any depiction of your God, savior, or saints that you pray before is an idol by definition.
    My understanding of this bible quote is that it doesn’t contradict Thelema. What Jesus is saying is to unite with the Godhead completely. Instead of attaching one’s self to distinct images, symbols, names, or aspects of the one true divine God, worship Him in his entirety with every part of you. This statement only contradicts thelema when you take into account that the Christian God is prone to human-like imperfection.
    Jesus is not relevant in this aeon. We don’t need suffering, shame, guilt, or pain. Our prophet The Beast saved us by teaching us how to live as kings upon the Earth and that all existence is pure joy. Your prophet is a symbol of suffering and self-sacrifice; the idea that one can or should “die for another’s sins” is outdated and false. but hey, Liber AL says: “All words are sacred and all prophets true; save only that they understand a little” Jesus and I just can’t agree on everything.

    93 93/93

  11. Derek
    December 6, 2011 at 12:06 am

    Hello Artemis93,

    I’m not sure where you come to the conclusion that Christians worship idols. I do agree that any image that we are praying would classify as an idol. Scripture doesn’t call us to pray to an image though, nor statue, or anything else that is to resemble God. When we pray we don’t have to have some image and shouldn’t have some image or relic before. Jesus, God, is omnipresent and always with His people, therefore we speak through the power of the Spirit and He hears.

    Lastly, the context of the passage is directly speaking to how worship of Jesus needs to be preiminent and done with all faculties. He is not delirious of compartmental worship nor half affections in worship.

    Grace and Peace

  12. Magellon
    December 27, 2011 at 9:41 am

    93

    Very glad that I happened upon this blog and this discussion. After spending the holidays with my Christian relatives as usual, it is all the more apparent to me the need for civility between our paradigms. Certainly long time Christians have much invested in their faiths and lifestyles. The immensity of implications that goes along with accepting other spiritual paths, (especially Thelema) can be intense for the superstitious. To do so may open their minds to emotions that may not be by their convention favorable; for sorrow, indifference, and injustice are easy to find and is discouraging to those without fortitude of self. However the greatest initiator is experience, to deny yourself experience is to deny yourself potential and capacity for real accomplishment and strength. Thelema is not for the uncourageous, but when delicately discussed, anyone can benefit from its depth and exactitude. “Our proof shall be in our successes”. Unlike Christianity, Thelema promulgates itself because those that need it will quest for it and find the certainty they seek. People should teach their children to appreciate the richness of life and to command their own emotions, not to fear their own thoughts and instincts. Coming from a Christian childhood I actually consider it child abuse, but nonetheless:

    “For these fools of men and their woes care not thou at all! They feel little; what is, is balanced by weak joys; but ye are my chosen ones.”

    93s

  13. jahrod the fallen titus
    May 24, 2012 at 6:50 am

    the wild beasts of the island shall cry in their desolate houses, the dragons in their pleasant palaces…BABYLON… her day is near to come her days shall not be prolonged

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